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karachay-balkars

Sawserok: tell you the truth, i don't like karachay-balkars who say they are pure and original caucasians, because they are not, they are turkic people in origin. and i don't like that Qylych guy from youtube, he is here somewhere where is he?

Ответов - 40, стр: 1 2 All

sergio: Sawserokу Народная мудрость: "Не пытайтесь впихнуть не впихуемое".

Sawserok: Taulu Uzden hey turki, your folk memory when it begins you think? can you give me a folk memory from 600 years ago? your folk memory maybe begins from 100 or 200 years ago, in times you lived with true caucasians for too long that you learned everything from them, does the ossetians got alanian folk memory? i think not, your materials are false and lies, yu mixed with caucasians and you liked the caucasian traditions and customs so you embraced it, and you started to behave like them learning the traditions, how many karachay-balkars lived 700 years ago? if in modern times karachay-balkars numbers are maybe 350,000 than how many lived in 700 years ago? you began as a nation from 1300's your ancestors were turkic nations, it doesn't matter if it is kypchak or something else, it is a turkic, you are not true caucasians, you just live there, you are trying to rewrtie history and make yourelves as caucasians. even if you are alans, and if alans were turkic as you say, you are still not caucasians, alans came from central asia. TRUE CAUCASIANS ARE : GEORGIANS, ABKHAZIANS, ADYGS, CHECHENS, INGUSHS, DAGESTANEES (not kumyks). they speak caucasian languages, and language say many things

Sawserok: Бёрюкъан Taulu Uzden Kypchaks are Karachays direct ancestors. Why deny the evident? read your own Karachay historians - H. Laipanov says Kypchaks played the leading role in Karachay - Balkar ethnogenesis. U. Aliev in his "Karachay" book first published in 1927 and then reprinted in 1997 says "The base for the Karachay people was founded by a group of refugees from the Cirmean peninsula, who denied the Tatar Khan's yoke and sought refuge in the Caucasus mountains... The outnumbered Karachays fought with the local Abaza tribes that levied heavy duties, but failed and were forced to lead a nomad life in order to find better shelter for their freedom, and, indeed, after they left "Eltarkach" (this is a place that they think the cradle of Karachay people is at) Karachays appear in the Baksan Gorge... By that time the newly-appeared power of Kabardian feudals starts to enslave the local mountaineer peoples, including Ingushs, Chechens and others. The powerful prince Kazi of Kabarda, grandson of Prince Inal, found out that Karachays settled in the Baksan gorge, demanded that Karachays (as cattle-drivers) pay tribute with cattle... With Karachay forcibly turned from a free people into tributaries of Kabardian feudal lords, the latter started terrible exploitation and in their despotism they went beyond all reasonable borders. Aside from traditional annual tribute of 300 sheep from the entire people, a basket of wheat and a large pitcher of butter from each household, any Kabardian prince passing by at any time could send his people to Karachay and take whatever he wanted as much as he pleased. This is the original Russian text "... Основу карачаевцев заложила группа беглецов с Крымского полуострова, не примирившихся с игом татарских ханов и искавших себе в горах Кавказа убежище для вольного существования... .. Неравная борьба карачаевцев с окружающими их здесь абазинцами, которые обложили их непосильными данями-оброками, скоро принудила их к скитальческой жизни, к поискам другого более надежного убежища для своей вольности и, действительно, после "Эльтаркача" они появляются в ущельи Баксан... К этому времени зародившееся могущество кабардинских феодалов... начинает закабаливать постепенно все горские народы, включая ингушей, чеченцев... и др. Могущественный феодал Кабарды, князь Кази, внук Инала, разузнавший о существовании карачаевцев в ущельи Баксан, предъявил им требование дани скотом (как с скотоводов). ... Превращением карачаевцев из вольного народа, насильственно, в данников кабардинских феодалов, начинается жестокая эксплуатация их последними, которые в своем произволе доходили до того, что не стали уже считаться ни с какими пределами. Кроме взимаемых ими, установленных по обычаю, оброков (ежегодная уплата 300 баранов от всех, сапетка пшеницы и большой кувшин коровьего масла с каждого двора), любой проходимец, из кабардинских князей, в любое время мог послать своих представителей в Карачай и брать столько, сколько ему благорассудилось You know that Alans came to the Caucasus in the 1st century AD. They were annihilated by Mongols in the 13 century. What it means is that they remained but a handful after that fight, locked in the mountains. I believe by that time as a result of 12 centuries of living among the local Caucasoid peoples they have acquired the Caucasoid looks. They continued to grow after the Mongols, very slowly, mixing with neighbors, mostly Georgians - if you ever come to Ossetia, you can't help noticing their resemblance with Georgians in a lot of ways from religion to culture to traditions. That's how Ossetians kept their original Alan (non-Caucasian) language and became Caucasoid looking. With Karachay Balkars it is a different story. There was a great battle between Tamerlane (Timur) and Toktamysh, the details of which you can discover here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tokhtamysh-Timur_war http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Terek_river The battle took place at the Terek River, in the territory of modern Kabardey, on April, 14, 1395. Both of them were Turks, but Tokhtamysh was a western Turk (Kipchak) and Timur came from Central Asia. Timur wiped the Tokhtamysh army off the face of the Earth. The surviving regiments fled into the Caucasus mountains, to the part that now is Balkar. They settled in the local Alan villages, and assimilated them language-wise. Later on, in 1600's some of them left this area and moved to Karachay. I think they heft the place because their Circassian (Kabardey) rulers (pshi) often moved their subjects from one place to another because the pshi fought with each other all the time and the defeated ones had to escape. Kipchak ancestry is everywhere aminig them - their language is identical, they kept A LOT of Kipchak traditions and even Kipchak ornaments on their carpets (kiiz) which they are so proud of. This is why there are Caucasoids (ex-Alans) among the Karachay-Balkars, yet they speak a Turkic (non-Caucasian, Kipchak, really) language and there are so many Mongoloid-looking people among them. P.S. Do you know that in 17-19 centuries they were called Mountainous Tatars by Russians? E. Alexeeva, a Russian scientist that wrote her "Karachays and Balkars - an ancient people of the Caucasus", said exactly this - KB, as a people, came into existance in the 13-14 centuries AD, as a mixture of local peoples, Alans, Bulgars and Kipchaks. The two of the latter are Turkic nomads that came to the Caucasus in 7-8 centuries AD. There's a Karachay scientist V.M. Batchayev, who says exactly the following: "Karachays and Balkars are descendants of Kypchaks and Bulgars". Nomad peoples, from the steppes of Crimea, Volga, Don. Pushed into the mointains by the Mongal advance. Take a look at linguistic dictionaries - Karachay-Balkar language is a part of the Western Kypchak language tree: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kypchak_languages


Бёрюкъан: Sawserok пишет: "... Основу карачаевцев заложила группа беглецов с Крымского полуострова, не примирившихся с игом татарских ханов и искавших себе в горах Кавказа убежище для вольного существования... .. Неравная борьба карачаевцев с окружающими их здесь абазинцами, которые обложили их непосильными данями-оброками, скоро принудила их к скитальческой жизни, к поискам другого более надежного убежища для своей вольности и, действительно, после "Эльтаркача" они появляются в ущельи Баксан... К этому времени зародившееся могущество кабардинских феодалов... начинает закабаливать постепенно все горские народы, включая ингушей, чеченцев... и др. Могущественный феодал Кабарды, князь Кази, внук Инала, разузнавший о существовании карачаевцев в ущельи Баксан, предъявил им требование дани скотом (как с скотоводов). ... Превращением карачаевцев из вольного народа, насильственно, в данников кабардинских феодалов, начинается жестокая эксплуатация их последними, которые в своем произволе доходили до того, что не стали уже считаться ни с какими пределами. Кроме взимаемых ими, установленных по обычаю, оброков (ежегодная уплата 300 баранов от всех, сапетка пшеницы и большой кувшин коровьего масла с каждого двора), любой проходимец, из кабардинских князей, в любое время мог послать своих представителей в Карачай и брать столько, сколько ему благорассудилось Эт не ты, случайно, в Википедию эту чушь поместил? Я еще "круче" могу написать, если что! А может и про то, что, мол, Билан - балкарец тоже ты в Википедии написал? Get out, my friend! Get out! Or talk in Russian! Then I'll begin to answer you! For now - Good bye!

Sawserok: Бёрюкъан hey fuck face, get over with it, you are a damn turk, your own people say that, karachays from turkey say that, only you who lived with caucasians try to behave like dickheads. and learn english, don't talk with me with the filthy russian language

HIGHLANDER: Из Израиля пишет... Судя по клинической картине, из адыгов. И прекрасно понимает по-русски, раз ориентируется в русском тексте... Выпендривается тупица.

Огъары Учкулан : просто в игнор, объяснять еще одному придурку "а" и "б", в очередной раз, еще и на английском... была халва...

Al'bina: по-моему он неадекватный..........и к тому же весьма неграмотный Sawserok I was born on Caucasus and I have the right to name myself of caucasus, and you no... As even speak can not in the Caucasian language... Also behave indecently

Огъары Учкулан : Al'bina джазады: и к тому же весьма неграмотный инглизча терсми джазады?))

Бёрюкъан: Sawserok, сowardly cock! You hide in Israel from me and such as I. Coward! All of you the cowards! And now, Good bye, coward! HIGHLANDER, бу къызтеке тварьчыкъны баннга чыгъарыб къояр мадар джокъмуду? Асыры хылымыла джазыб тебрегенди! Причина барды кетерирге! Мундагъы тварьчыкъладан болса, биягъы привычкама кёре, разборкагъа чакъырлыкъ эдим. Алай а бу тварьчыкъ Израильде эсе, андан хылымылычыкъла джазыб тургъандан сора, связьгъа чыгъаргъа излерик тюлдю.



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